More and more gainsayers are coming out of apostate Christendom even saying that this speculation on 9-23 and the STAR SIGN is both an embarrassment to the Church, and is dangerous and should not be allowed! The ones promoting this rapture date are totally wrong, and there is NO WAY that Christ will return on 9-23-2017.
Now the ones attacking those who are issuing a sort of MIDNIGHT CRY are doing so in a very nasty and mean-spirited way, actually proving out the scripture concerning “Where is the promise of His coming? We see no evidence whatsoever of any return, and further, those people who started all of this are babes in the faith and have no knowledge whatsoever to be making such claims! We, on the other hand, are SEASONED, EXPERIENCED ELDERS WHO KNOW ALL THERE IS TO KNOW, AND WE KNOW CHRIST CANNOT RETURN NOW!!”
As it was, so shall it. Remember all the gainsayers in Noah’s day? Right up until the rain began to fall, that is, they had their “normalcy” and could not think whatsoever outside the box, and could not, and would not, believe that anything was coming or anything was going to change. But it did.
Now Jesus said that “as it was in the days of Noah so shall it be”. So here we have a small of group of people basically outside the church in many ways, issuing a WARNING CRY that Jesus is coming, just as Noah issued warnings about the coming storm, and they mocked him. You know how curious people are? There must have been a number of serious warnings, but no one could believe it, they had never seen rain before!!! Same with Lot, even his relatives did not believe him, and Lot himself was reluctant to leave and so the angels had to all but drag him out of his home and leave the area!! Lot loved his “normalcy” as well.
So why are we so reluctant to BELIEVE that Jesus could and well might return in the next few days? The answer is, we want our normalcy and FEAR CHANGE. The FEAR of CHANGE, and the FEAR OF JUDGMENT, as well as the FEAR WE MIGHT BE WRONG. Mixed in with all of this is the inner heart of all of these huge ministries. They do not want ANYTHING TO CHANGE, and they want to maintain their power and positions as “leaders” in the “church systems”.
So here is the question – would it make any difference if the Lord gave us ALL OF THESE SIGNS ONCE AGAIN FOR FEAST OF TRUMPETS 2018? Would we not have the very same gainsayers within the Church ridiculing those who were giving another midnight cry? Would they not be derided and said they were crazy people, and it is dangerous to speculate? That they are wrong, totally wrong, and NO WAY is Jesus going to return then? Me thinks so. Same goes for 2019, 2020, 2021 and so on.
Do we not have the promise of the Lord that He will come back and get us, and does He not ask us to PRAY ALWAYS that we be counted worthy to stand before the Son of Man and escape ALL OF THESE THINGS? So, the end of all of this is UNBELIEF, and ALL of us are most likely in various degrees in UNBELIEF! That may well be why the Lord has given warnings and warnings, and signs after signs because, as He said in paraphrase, “when I return will I find any FAITH in the Earth?” The answer of course is “NO!!” The only faith the Church has now is a fake, and a powerless faith, a “I dunno, maybe, maybe not.” This type of faith is FAKE and not a Biblical faith.
The world is full of skeptics and wants a sign. Perhaps the only sign that would wake the world up to something is either 3 days of darkness or 3 hours of darkness, take your pick. This would most likely be just after the rapture of the Church, rather than just before! That would be a big announcement, would it not?
The chance that this year, in the next few days, after all of the signs in the heavens and on Earth, is that something very big, and“out of the ordinary” is going to take place. Especially in Israel, with the talk of the Temple, the cries of their Rabbis to RETURN TO THE HOLY LAND are going forth RIGHT NOW. All this is out there for EVERYONE TO SEE, and yet, for all of the signs, mathematics and “coincidences”, the gainsayers are screaming bloody murder and those who believe in a pre-trib rapture are “not sure”.
And then we have such things as the Strong’s numbers all pointing to a rapture, such as the 726 days from the last BLOOD RED MOON to the 9-23 date. And Strong’s number 726 is the same word used in Revelation 4 and 12, and in Paul’s writings for THE RAPTURE OF THE CHURCH. And what is even more astounding is that the Strong’s word number 725 means TO STEAL, a THIEF!!! I think somewhere I heard Jesus tell us He was going to return as a thief!!
And yet, most people I know are all too willing to put this off in the future somewhere, not today, not tomorrow, but sometime yet far away. However, having said all that, and with all the evidence pointing to 9-23 as a date of change, what happens if that day comes and goes and nothing happens? Then the gainsayers will have a field day and will attempt to silence any more such “date setting”, be it via the cosmos signs or signs on the Earth. It simply feeds the skeptics, and all normalcy returns. Nothing has, or will change since the fathers fell asleep!! There is something concerning the gainsayers that fulfills what Jesus said about a “delay”. The gainsayers come out in force to beat upon their fellow servants with a vengeance, and Jesus warns these gainsayers that He will come upon them when THEY do not expect it, and they will be appointed as UNBELIEVERS.
I believe that it shows the real hearts of these powerful ministries that are mocking everything concerning the so-called STAR SIGN and its possible relationship to the Rapture of the Church. Almost all their arguments used to dismiss all of this are INVALID ARGUMENTS, and show just how APOSTATE the Church has become. These folks are COLD, MEAN and HAUGHTY and it shows in reality they most likely don’t have a clue about what it means to GO TO THE REAL CROSS OF CHRIST. While they point the finger at the people who are earnestly attempting to point out what this may mean and call them FALSE PROPHETS, they themselves are the REAL FALSE PROPHETS.
One needs to look into the GOOD BOOK, check out everything and see if the evidence presented appears to be accurate and that the signs in the heavens and on Earth are coming together as they should. If so, then Jesus says He is AT THE DOOR, and in this case, the DOOR is a PORTAL and PORTALS OPEN SUDDENLY and with NO WARNING. Inasmuch as the signs all appear to be lining themselves up for 9-22-23-2017, there most likely will not be any more “precursor events” to warn us of anything unusual. And because the Lord knows He is dealing with skeptics and gainsayers of all types, why should He provide any more evidence to us? Maybe or maybe not the sign of Jonah and 3 days of darkness, but if He did, well, perhaps the comatose world MIGHT take notice!!
Israel did not recognize Jesus or the SIGNS that He was coming to Earth. Only the wise men studied the heavens and knew what to watch for. When they saw it, they moved upon that sign without hesitation. They were the wise ones, who studied and knew what to look for. Likewise, it appears that only the wise are reading the SIGNS IN THE HEAVENS and ON EARTH and their EYES and HEARTS can see what the blind cannot see!!
By the way, the NEW MOON has been sighted in Israel and Trumpets, as I understand it, has begun, and will end on SUNDOWN, 9-22-2017 in Israel at 5:59 at the LAST TRUMPET. If the LAST TRUMP blown here is replied to in the HEAVENS, then the world will have entered a NEW ERA, and the Lord will once again take up the Abrahamic and Davidic Covenants, which means that Jesus will likewise fulfill His covenant with the Church.
Now what happens if 9-23 goes by and the Church is still here? I would not be concerned in the slightest, because there are a number of variables in all of this, and interpretations of Scripture, which may or may not be correct. The only argument that the gainsayers have that may hold some merit is the mention in Thessalonians that THE DAY OF CHRIST CANNOT COME UNTIL THE MAN OF SIN IS REVEALED and that happens when he goes into the Holy Place in the Temple and stands where he ought not.
This revelation is to ISRAEL, and obviously occurs during Daniels’s 70th week. So the argument is over what the word apostasy or FALLING AWAY actually means. In the early days, the word was interpreted as DEPARTURE, or a STANDING APART. I found some interesting articles that concerns this debate:
“As always thanks so much for your great site. I have a question regarding the word apostasia found in 2 Thes 2:3. I have recently seen several commentaries that state that the word was used 15 times in the NT and only 3 times actually meaning apostasy, and that prior to the King James version the commentaries stated the word meant departure and not apostasy. Does this in fact say that the day will not come for the son of perdition except that we will be departed (raptured) or is it referring to the apostasy.
The meaning of the Greek word apostasia has always been the same and it only appears twice in the New Testament. Before the King James translation of 1611 it was translated departure because it’s derived from a root word that can mean departure. (It’s the root word that appears more often.) But even then the idea being conveyed is that it’s a departure from a condition or circumstance not a physical location. For example one of its meanings is divorce.
The sequence of events in 2 Thes. 2 does not depend on the meaning of apostasia, because however you translate it the Church will disappear before the anti-Christ is revealed. 2 Thes. 2:7-8 verify this.” – From Grace through faith
Here is another article from Five Doves:
Guy Schwartz (30 Sep 2011)
“‘GREAT APOSTASY’ or DEPARTURE/DISAPPEARANCE – Rapture first”
Have you guys ever considered our translation or understanding of this verse, 2 Thess. 2:3 might be wrong or negative, therefore the cause of this misunderstanding? Could this verse be saying the rapture has to happen first (not a falling away of faith, as so many teach)? Check this out, and investigate it: The Greek noun apostasia comes from the root verb aphestimi, meaning “to go away, depart, to remove.” The word aphestimi is used fifteen times in the Bible. Eleven times it is translated depart and refers only once to departing from faith. Eight times it is used as a departure from a person or a place, according to W.E. Vines Dictionary of Greek Words (page 297, number 20).
While the primary meaning of apostasia alludes to a rebellion from truth, there is a secondary meaning. According to the Liddell and Scott Classical Lexicon, the second meaning of apostasia is “a departing, or a disappearance.”
Before the 1611 King James translation, most of the Bibles translated the phrase “falling away” as “the departing.” The following men translated falling away as departure: Lineberry, B.A., Cloverdale (1535), Crammer (1539), Robert Baker (1615), Beza (1565), John Dawson, A.B. says “apostasia” means “a departure from any place.” Robert Scott (1811-1887) gives the second meaning of apostasia as “departure, disappearance.” And any of you who have done a serious study of translations know that the KJV is not ‘perfect’ in all it’s Greek translations, as Chinese scholar Watchman Nee found out.
Kenneth Wuest, world renowned Greek scholar translates 2 Thess. 2:3 as follows: “Do not allow anyone to lead you astray in any way, because that day shall not come (Second Coming of Christ) except the aforermentioned departure (rapture of the church to heaven) comes first, AND the man of lawlessness is disclosed (in his true identity), the man of perdition …” (The New Testament – An Expanded Translation by Wuest)
The context of the scripture determines the meaning of the word. Wuest points out that if Paul were talking about doctrine in 2 Thess. 2, one could say he was alluding to a huge revolt or defection from the truth that would happen before the man of sin was revealed. Yet, Paul reminded them “when I was with you I told you these things.” When Paul came back from Mt. Sinai (Arabia) and meeting Jesus in person (Gal. 1:12-17), he received the revelation directly from Jesus Christ (see this page) about the Rapture. He told the church of Thessalonica FIRST, of this previous mystery – the catching away (rapture) of the church. A mystery is something that was hidden to the people in the past (Old Testament crowd), but is NOW being revealed. The mystery of the Rapture, and salvation being offered to the Gentiles, was given to Paul to announce. A false letter was being circulated as to be from Paul, so he wrote again to that church to warn them – I didn’t say that (that the Lord had already returned). His first letter (1 Thess. 4:16,17) contained the Rapture revelation. Wuest and other Greek scholars believe Paul was saying that this man of sin (antichrist) could not be revealed until there was first a departing of the church to heaven (rapture event)!
Read www.AngelsOnAssignment.org/why_aoa.html for more detail.
Shalom, Guy Schwartz
- The Rapture is MOST DEFINITELY a PRE-TRIB event, no doubt whatsoever! Why do people fight against this blessed hope, meant to encourage us to hang in there, and assure the believers that will not experience God’s wrath – is that not what the Gospel message teaches – we have been reconciled to God thru our Lord Jesus Christ?
How Apostasia Has Been Translated
Jerome translated the Greek New Testament into Latin in the 4th century (the Vulgate). He used the Latin word discessio, meaning �departure,� for the Greek word apostasia. This meaning was continued in the earliest English translations such as the Wycliff Bible (1384), Tyndale Bible (1526), Coverdale Bible (1535), Cranmer Bible (1539), Breeches Bible (1576), Beza Bible (1583), and Geneva Bible (1608). The King James Version deviated from this translation, translating apostasia as �falling away.� No explanation was given for doing this. Moreover, Theodore Beza transliterated apostasia as apostasy, rather than translating it. Since the 17th century, the consistent understanding of apostasia in modern translations has been rebellion (NIV, NRSV, Goodspeed, RSV, Moffatt, Phillips, Jerusalem Bible, Williams), or falling away (Berkeley, ASV, NKJV).
My take on all of this is that this applies to BOTH A GREAT APOSTASY or falling away from the TRUE FAITH, which is now in FULL FORCE, but it also means A DEPARTURE or RAPTURE. In other words, it is a double meaning, much like the STAR SIGN, which has two meanings, one for the Church and one for the occult forces. To the Church, the manchild means THE CHURCH WILL BE BORN or MANIFESTED, and then caught up to Heaven, but to the occult, the manchild is THE ARRIVAL OF THE FALLEN ONES, but to them THE GODS, to set up their NEW WORLD ORDER and the GOLDEN AGE OF THE GODS. The Church goes up, the fallen ones come down!!
They both fit and fit well. Don’t mock the STAR SIGN until we are well past it and NOTHING HAS OCCURRED. And as I said, then it’s back to the drawing boards to find out what we missed and why!!